Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#21
Ogee wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 8:44 pm
Hi, taking signals without real time reference to market activity, chart structure, momentum and recognition of where buyers and sellers are actually doing business is never going to work.

So an indicator needs to be read in context and ignored if the market or chart are not conducive. Learning to read charts is more important and is the first skill set needed before adding any indicators.

These skills allow you to anticipate where and when an opportunity is likely to develop, and when you see them, then looking to indicators for confimation will be more rewarding.
Thanks for the reply. So basically price action, correct, which I mentioned can be very subjective. And those methods would be very difficult to put into an EA but there are algorithmic traders that profit (not common) but not common for manual traders to profit consistently either. And indicators should be able to read momentum and such too if done right. There is too much information out there and too many scams. I wouldn't know where to actually learn this stuff and not just waste my time and babypips is elementary. Plus, the london and US session are in the middle of the night for me so EA was more realistic.


Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#22
kizerage212 wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:36 am
Thanks for the reply. So basically price action, correct, which I mentioned can be very subjective. And those methods would be very difficult to put into an EA but there are algorithmic traders that profit (not common) but not common for manual traders to profit consistently either. And indicators should be able to read momentum and such too if done right. There is too much information out there and too many scams. I wouldn't know where to actually learn this stuff and not just waste my time and babypips is elementary. Plus, the london and US session are in the middle of the night for me so EA was more realistic.
.
Not basically just price action no, though PA is important.

Every market has it's own unique characteristics, Dax for example usually starts on the London open with high volatility for 2-3 hours then calms down and waits for the US open when volatility picks up again. Trading during low volatility is going to be very difficult and likely lose any money made during the first 3 hours. Know your market.

Chart structure highlights levels where large buyers or sellers are likely waiting, they know they have a better chance to turn the market if they act together but where that is needs to be constantly updated. The chart will tell you where they are most likely to be.

None of this is subjective, it's all readable on the chart.

Algo trading by large firms makes up around 70% of all trades and they are profitable but can cost millions and are constantly being updated and are linked to high frequency super fast connections.

There are cheaper algos but the snag is would you sell a profitable one if you were using it to grow your account to super size? But many that are for sale allow free trials so no harm in looking except in time spent.

But the good news is building your own algo is the same as bulding a manual trading plan. Choose your market and get to know it. Choose your time frame. Choose the market conditions when you would apply your plan. Choose one repeating setup that has good positive expectancy, decide on a repeatable entry and exit trigger (usually uses indicators) and then test it.

There are plenty of profitable traders, they just don't tend to be newbies. Brokers state around 70% of their clients lose money but many of those same people come back time and time again until they have learnt enough to be in the 30% who make money.

No one said it would be easy, good luck.

.

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#23
ionone wrote:
Tue Sep 01, 2020 12:06 am

what is your kind of holy grail ?

thanks

Jeff
Gann said something about how important is to constantly monitor the trend and trade with the trend or something like that....so, if you know what the trend is, then you have a Holy Grail, I think. Today i had about 60 trades, few tiny losses, rest was winners, trading with the trend is best thing to do, you can have bad entry, and still make money, if your analysis about trend is right.

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#24
Ogee wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:18 pm
.
There are plenty of profitable traders, they just don't tend to be newbies. Brokers state around 70% of their clients lose money but many of those same people come back time and time again until they have learnt enough to be in the 30% who make money.

No one said it would be easy, good luck.

.
I have seen one big study, that shows, that after 6 months, only 0.04% are profitable. 99.96% lose all their money in 6 months.

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#25
ZZTop wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:45 am
I have seen one big study, that shows, that after 6 months, only 0.04% are profitable. 99.96% lose all their money in 6 months.
Take me 6 years to be profitable. Hope that answer you question.


Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#27
Ogee wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:18 pm
.
Not basically just price action no, though PA is important.

Every market has it's own unique characteristics, Dax for example usually starts on the London open with high volatility for 2-3 hours then calms down and waits for the US open when volatility picks up again. Trading during low volatility is going to be very difficult and likely lose any money made during the first 3 hours. Know your market.

Chart structure highlights levels where large buyers or sellers are likely waiting, they know they have a better chance to turn the market if they act together but where that is needs to be constantly updated. The chart will tell you where they are most likely to be.

None of this is subjective, it's all readable on the chart.

Algo trading by large firms makes up around 70% of all trades and they are profitable but can cost millions and are constantly being updated and are linked to high frequency super fast connections.

There are cheaper algos but the snag is would you sell a profitable one if you were using it to grow your account to super size? But many that are for sale allow free trials so no harm in looking except in time spent.

But the good news is building your own algo is the same as bulding a manual trading plan. Choose your market and get to know it. Choose your time frame. Choose the market conditions when you would apply your plan. Choose one repeating setup that has good positive expectancy, decide on a repeatable entry and exit trigger (usually uses indicators) and then test it.

There are plenty of profitable traders, they just don't tend to be newbies. Brokers state around 70% of their clients lose money but many of those same people come back time and time again until they have learnt enough to be in the 30% who make money.

No one said it would be easy, good luck.

.
THanks for your long explanation. The real trick now is to either find someone else who is profitable who could teach you (and not scam you) or try to figure it out on your own. But that can be harder on your own because you are sometimes reinventing the wheel with things that if taught properly could pick up much faster. The problem is most are scams and you can't really trust them. Do you know any trust worthy places to actually learn effectively or even a paid program that isn't a scam, perhaps or ALGO? You can PM me if you want, instead if better. Thanks

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#28
kizerage212 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:17 pm
THanks for your long explanation. The real trick now is to either find someone else who is profitable who could teach you (and not scam you) or try to figure it out on your own. But that can be harder on your own because you are sometimes reinventing the wheel with things that if taught properly could pick up much faster. The problem is most are scams and you can't really trust them. Do you know any trust worthy places to actually learn effectively or even a paid program that isn't a scam, perhaps or ALGO? You can PM me if you want, instead if better. Thanks
Yes finding good honest mentor would be a great help and time saver but in practice is hard to do. Learning to trade is an individual journey, no two traders are the same.

Some say the skills just aren't transferable and so you need to find someone who can encourage your own developement rather than just show you what they do because that never seems to work out.

I've seen many go from mentor to mentor learning a little from each but not a enough before running out of money and also there are a great many out and out scammers.

I couldn't recommend anyone as I never found a shortcut and as others have posted above the journey seems to take years for most people. I have heard many recommend various courses but if taking that route you would need to find one that matched your own preferences (markets, time frames, type of trades etc).

I don't know enough about algos to comment on them, maybe someone else can offer some advice.

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#29
Ogee wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:05 pm
Yes finding good honest mentor would be a great help and time saver but in practice is hard to do. Learning to trade is an individual journey, no two traders are the same.

Some say the skills just aren't transferable and so you need to find someone who can encourage your own developement rather than just show you what they do because that never seems to work out.

I've seen many go from mentor to mentor learning a little from each but not a enough before running out of money and also there are a great many out and out scammers.

I couldn't recommend anyone as I never found a shortcut and as others have posted above the journey seems to take years for most people. I have heard many recommend various courses but if taking that route you would need to find one that matched your own preferences (markets, time frames, type of trades etc).

I don't know enough about algos to comment on them, maybe someone else can offer some advice.
I think one of the few legit algorithmic teacher is Kevin Davey (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjTZtW ... uxy_7GjySQ)
but he is still selling stuff so idk. Why do people that are making money need to sell anything? doesn't make sense to me
but hey, maybe his information is valuable

Re: What kind of Holy Grail ?

#30
kizerage212 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:17 pm
ALGO?
The best known in Europe will be Yves Hilpisch. He has taught poeple and written about algorithmic trading for ages.
He who can read will still (for a while) have an advantage.
Publications from 2020 only:
Python for Algorithmic Trading: From Idea to Cloud Deployment
Detecting regime change in computational finance: data science, machine learning and algorithmic trading
Machine Learning for Algorithmic Trading: Predictive models to extract signals from market and alternative data for systematic trading strategies with Python, 2nd Edition
Algorithmic Trading Methods: Applications Using Advanced Statistics, Optimization, and Machine Learning Techniques


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