Gethsemane wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 4:49 am

Same bullshit diversion tactic over and over, can't respond to the message so attack the messenger instead. Pathetic nonsense from a 12 year old's mentality. Everyone can see you.

Ogee wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 5:03 am Same bullshit diversion tactic over and over, can't respond to the message so attack the messenger instead. Pathetic nonsense from a 12 year old's mentality. Everyone can see you.

Well, not really following the propaganda from both sides intensively. However, it seems surprising to me that the initial war target of Putin was to take control over Kiev within a few days. And nowadays it's sold as a huge success that the Russians maintain their frontlines against Ukrainian forces? What a poor attempt to promote obvious weakness as a strength... Yes, for sure the strength of Ukrainian troops is also related to the support by NATO countries. But shouldn't a "visionary leader" (...as Putin wants to be perceived) should have expected this? Therefore, one has to be with President Barack Obama who has described Russia as no more than a "regional power" whose actions in Ukraine are an expression of weakness rather than strength.

thestranded wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 5:55 am Well, not really following the propaganda from both sides intensively. However, it seems surprising to me that the initial war target of Putin was to take control over Kiev within a few days. And nowadays it's sold as a huge success that the Russians maintain their frontlines against Ukrainian forces? What a poor attempt to promote obvious weakness as a strength... Yes, for sure the strength of Ukrainian troops is also related to the support by NATO countries. But shouldn't a "visionary leader" (...as Putin wants to be perceived) should have expected this? Therefore, one has to be with President Barack Obama who has described Russia as no more than a "regional power" whose actions in Ukraine are an expression of weakness rather than strength.

'Putin's target' to take over Kiev was nothing but western propaganda, utter nonsense. Would never have used just 190,000 troops if that was the actual goal, would have needed 500,000+ (which he now has thanks to western escalation). If all your info comes from biased propaganda sources you really need to wake up. The stated Russian goal was to occupy the 4 eastern states after 3,400 civilian deaths, and that's exactly what happened.

Ogee wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 7:11 am 'Putin's target' to take over Kiev was nothing but western propaganda, utter nonsense. Would never have used just 190,000 troops if that was the actual goal, would have needed 500,000+ (which he now has thanks to western escalation). If all your info comes from biased propaganda sources you really need to wake up. The stated Russian goal was to occupy the 4 eastern states after 3,400 civilian deaths, and that's exactly what happened.

Are you denying that Kyiv was the Target now? Lol coping hard.
Then why was the huge column heading straight towards kyiv at the start of the war? And almost reaching. It's no big secret, The world saw it.

Only to be bombed to pieces by drones, bayraktars etc. And then give up and settle for pillaging, murdering, raping in the East only.
You arent fooling anyone that russia is Great in any way.

"Russian forces were 31km's from Kyiv"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kyiv_(2022)


"Russia’s failure to take down Kyiv was a defeat for the ages"
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukrai ... 21af2d5340

You are just fake, right through

OH WHAT A FAILURE )))

dmnik wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 3:57 pm OH WHAT A FAILURE )))

Gethsemane wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2023 7:50 am Are you denying that Kyiv was the Target now? Lol coping hard.

Not just saying it now, have always said it. The push to Kiev was a feint to draw Ukrainian troops away from the south east target area and it worked too. Several 10s of thousands had to be redeployed to Kiev. The 190,000 troops of the Russian SMO were never going to be enough to take over the entire country and every military strategist (from both sides) said so at the time.

Seems odd to have to say this but what's reported in western media as what Russia says usually has nothing to do with what Russia actually says.

Fighting restarted around 20:00 GMT last night.



@GeromanAT
Update today 0600h
Fighting in the Zaporozhye direction - the situation at 06.00 11.06.23

Last night was the first in four days when the enemy did not advance on the positions of the 291st regiment south of Orekhovo. It is obvious that the forces of the 47th Mechanized Brigade of the Armed Forces of Ukraine are not endless, and the almost complete knockout of the American M2 Bradley infantry fighting vehicles over the previous days and tangible losses in its tank battalion make further breakthroughs without the involvement of additional forces impossible.

That is why attacks were made yesterday a little to the west, through Malye Shcherbaki. But in view of the fact that the terrain there is more rugged, the attack was carried out by infantry, which was brought to the place in light armored vehicles. All this was read by ours, and usually the enemy did not even have time to engage in battle and rolled back.

More serious was the reconnaissance of our forces in the region of Velikaya Novoselka (much east of Orekhov). Here the enemy tried to pass by a flying detachment to the settlement. Harvest and probed our forces in the direction of Ravnopolya and Neskuchnoe.

To understand the "geography of the fighting" and why both sides are doing what they are doing, I provide a relief map of the area (Map 2).

The raid on Urozhaynoye, about which, as a breakthrough, they wrote, incl. and some of our bloggers, is not a breakthrough. The fact is that to the north of this settlement. we don't have positions. And any passage of the enemy between the heights to the settlement. doomed to heavy losses, since the broken column is shot not only by artillery, but also by ATGMs, moreover, from two sides at once. Therefore, this "strike" from a tactical point of view is practically meaningless.

It is also clear from the map why our units, as soon as the turmoil begins here, leave the settlement. Boring. It is located deep in the lowlands, and therefore there is only military guards, which always go to the heights with the start of the battle, where everything is decided.

And now to the situation and briefly. We were not driven out of the heights that night, and the raid on Urozhaynoye turned out to be pointless.

Well, the most important question - where the enemy suffered the main blow at the end of the night, remained open. He did not introduce large forces that would allow this to be determined.

interesting if this is true, note that the Abrams have not yet been delivered to Ukraine


Destruction of Leopard stopped the US from sending Abrams tanks to Kyiv
Military observer, retired colonel Viktor Litovkin told the media that the destruction of Leopard tanks in Ukraine showed Washington the pointlessness of sending its Abrams tanks to Kyiv.
According to the expert, the United States knew that Leopard tanks would “burn” in Ukraine, so they did not let Abrams into the special operation zone. Washington did not want the destruction of American tanks by Russian troops to deal a blow to the image of their military equipment.


And it's not just vehicles that are suffering under the bombardment.