I like Gann for his interest for non-orthodox approaches. NTL, I try to put single parts to one big picture which make sense for me and amazingly I see afterwards, that pro traders do it quite similar. But all this leads to nothing for your thread. You want to show us your way to see the market. Go on. We try to follow.

PS: I'm still the only one who voted.

### #22

[QUOTE=Krelian99]I like Gann for his interest for non-orthodox approaches. NTL, I try to put single parts to one big picture which make sense for me and amazingly I see afterwards, that pro traders do it quite similar. But all this leads to nothing for your thread. You want to show us your way to see the market. Go on. We try to follow.

PS: I'm still the only one who voted.[/QUOTE]

Tobi,of course we will be participate with you both,just reading this dialogue and plus/minus argue,believe me it increasing our knowledge and aside from ..... seems a table talk on socialism ver democracy

PS: I'm still the only one who voted.[/QUOTE]

Tobi,of course we will be participate with you both,just reading this dialogue and plus/minus argue,believe me it increasing our knowledge and aside from ..... seems a table talk on socialism ver democracy

Indicator is just a tool.

Use it only if it can benefit you. Leave it if you don't know how to use it optimally.

Use it only if it can benefit you. Leave it if you don't know how to use it optimally.

### #23

[QUOTE=Krelian99] But all this leads to nothing for your thread. You want to show us your way to see the market. Go on. We try to follow.

PS: I'm still the only one who voted.[/QUOTE]

Hahaahaha,

Not so boss - not my way - THE WAY TO SEE THE MARKET - that is crucial. You mentioned pro's which leads me to ask if you are on Linkedin? If you are PM me so I can invite you as a contact simply so we can join up and so you might see what is really going on with this to understand that what I am sharing here is bigger than you and I (if not a member and you are curious to know what I mean, it is easy to join). But thanks for voting, everything in life is a process (including sharing an idea). Do try and read up the stuff on offer though - because I sincerely feel you might change your views if you did and that will make me real glad. Why? Because then when we do actually start discussing the topic others may become more interested given you are very engaging and I can see you are passionate about things. So am I.

Cheers,

PS: I'm still the only one who voted.[/QUOTE]

Hahaahaha,

Not so boss - not my way - THE WAY TO SEE THE MARKET - that is crucial. You mentioned pro's which leads me to ask if you are on Linkedin? If you are PM me so I can invite you as a contact simply so we can join up and so you might see what is really going on with this to understand that what I am sharing here is bigger than you and I (if not a member and you are curious to know what I mean, it is easy to join). But thanks for voting, everything in life is a process (including sharing an idea). Do try and read up the stuff on offer though - because I sincerely feel you might change your views if you did and that will make me real glad. Why? Because then when we do actually start discussing the topic others may become more interested given you are very engaging and I can see you are passionate about things. So am I.

Cheers,

### #26

The concept of fractals as outlined in the chaology requires no rules at all and no indicators to understand and read the markets as fractal. Rather, it explains the behavior and character of numbers in the patten of points that create the shapes and forms we see on live price charts. Once we understand that, we gain an insight that make us lose any fear of the market as we now come to understand that it is all about structure and what that dynamic structure allows in terms of timing and range (trading opportunities). Really, any trader should be able to grow from say a 50/60 return ratio to an 80/90 return ratio over time. Why? Because you now follow not the partial understanding of TA (and FA) but the actual rules of the mathematical structure you have come to understand. From that structure you can now see the discrete moves per period and the approximate range for such moves. Therefore, you know when to enter a trade (with near certainty of outcome, i.e. 95% confidence), for what range approximately and when to exit the trade. All of this strictly based on the actual laws of market dynamics as found out by the mathematics of chaos and fractal geometry. It is really now a new era the way I understand it. But of course it will take time for other traders already ingrained with other ways of trading to begin to appreciate the power of chaos. And for now I cannot directly display this power because our equipment is not in place. But eventually we shall see and share what I am talking about more directly. Like I said, we cannot show anything concrete of our model at this time. But we see here just a partial view (single resolution or profile of the market). With a complete profiling, reading for timing and range is a breeze (per discrete flow). Also we do not predict - NEVER. We read the fractalities and wait to follow the flow once the flow is locked in direction. Trading by instant analysis almost for any available opportunity (i.e. you can tell if a move is intraday, swing or position play). It does not get any simpler or more accurate and all because we cracked the math.

### #27

Bill Williams says that chaos is just a state of higher order we still don't understand. A lack of information or we use the given information wrong. Darkdoji, what do we miss when we think the markets are chaotic or a product of fantasy?

### #28

[QUOTE=Krelian99]Bill Williams says that chaos is just a state of higher order we still don't understand. A lack of information or we use the given information wrong. Darkdoji, what do we miss when we think the markets are chaotic or a product of fantasy?[/QUOTE] I am not sure I understand your point(s) please could you be more specific? Regardless, let me just offer this in passing - Bill Williams is

Cheers, and I hope I made some sense.

**NOT**an authority on chaos theory or fractal geometry - I personally, have never considered his views directly because from his indicators, it is clear to me, that he adds nothing to the understanding of the chaology of markets. That said, his ideas (on fractals) reflects more the concept of**support**and**resistance**in Technical Analysis and downplays the mathematical notion of fractals as the all-pervading iterates they are. As such, his ideas (as expressed in his indicators) tend to restrict the understanding and use of the knowledge of the fractal structure of markets. In that sense, his ideas about chaos and fractals really mean nothing more than what any support and resistance technical indicator allows (nor do any other of his indicators indicate what mathematics considers the chaology of markets - they are just Technical indicators for TA applications). The point I am making is we can now apply a more holistic view of the market as a fractal (i.e. the complete unit) and use that wider perspective to read and trade the markets rather than be restricted by what I would liken to linear approximations to the nonlinear functions that define market fractality. In simple terms, they slow you down (insofar as understanding what it means for a system to be chaotic, fractal and nonlinear). But of course I am speaking here based on fractals as we define it in the chaology. ?Cheers, and I hope I made some sense.

### #30

This and some other points I'm d'accord with him. I don't see him as authority. I also don't like his fractals using as support/resistance.

[QUOTE]But of course I am speaking here based on fractals as we define it in the chaology. ?[/QUOTE]

Then show us your definition of a fractal... But why you need all these indicators? What has that to do with Chaos Theory? There are also fractals that looks like the ones from B. Williams.

[QUOTE]But of course I am speaking here based on fractals as we define it in the chaology. ?[/QUOTE]

Then show us your definition of a fractal... But why you need all these indicators? What has that to do with Chaos Theory? There are also fractals that looks like the ones from B. Williams.